Michał Niewęgłowski, co-creator of the Intu application, tells us about where the idea for such a business came from, why more men than women meditate by phone and whether it is possible to make money on slow life in Poland.
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Meditation app. Here's what's in it
Natalia Kraus-Kowalczyk, Business Insider Polska: Where did the idea to create such an application come from? Was it a shock after working in a corporation?
Michał Niewęgłowski, creator of the Intu application: In a way, yes. My – as it later turned out – dear friend and then acquaintance who is both an entrepreneur and a psychologist came to me. He had several businesses under his belt, which he sold, and he ran companies employing several dozen people. He meditated himself and his main intention was to create an application that would provide tools in the form of meditation for people overloaded with work – both corporate employees and entrepreneurs.
He himself experienced burnout, after which he had to go to South America and cross it on a motorcycle to reset several years of pressure and pace. Meditation helped him a lot to regain balance and he decided that it was a good idea to introduce it in Poland.
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What exactly is in the application?
There are several things: secular meditations, psychoeducation, so-called processes that are therapeutic in nature – some of them are recorded by certified psychotherapists. There are also “mindfulness” games and activities related to everyday life. For example, you can randomize certain tasks and collect karma points – the more tasks, the more complex they are and the more points you earn. Completing these tasks can become a contribution to changing habits in your life, so that when meeting everyday challenges, you do not get lost and maintain a healthy distance and internal balance.
Where did you start? It's now a very powerful application.
The beginnings were very humble. A friend of mine came to me with the idea in October, and in March we released the application – that's astronomical pace to create something like that in 4-5 months. But it was an MVP, a minimum viable product. There were literally dozens of recordings, it was basically a meditation player.
How many years ago was this?
9 years ago. It was the first such product on the market in Poland, in Polish. It caught on quickly right away. We gradually developed and now we have the third version of the application, both the design and functionality have changed. Above all, the amount of content has changed – there are now several hundred meditations, processes, games and activities. When I look at the screenshots from the beginning, I think to myself “it's amazing that it caught on” (smile).
How many people work on it?
Currently 10 people. Some people are in orbit – for example, the graphic designer is not with us all the time, but has been working with us permanently for about 5 years. Some employees work on a project basis, for a given functionality, and some work on a much more full-time basis.
Maintaining work-life balance by Poles. Application developer: the needs are growing
When I talk to experts about slow life or work-life balance, I sometimes hear that there is no space for this in Poland yet. We are still in a rush for money and we don't have time for it. What do you think?
I don't agree with this at all. There is demand and it is getting bigger. On the one hand, this is done by the need of the times, because people are really tired, burnt out and, above all, overstimulated – not only by making money, but generally by the digital lifestyle and life overloaded with information. It has become so popular that no one is surprised that someone is looking for some kind of balance.
It is a growing market. All estimates, even global ones, show that the market for mental health, work-life balance, slow life, yoga and meditation is expected to grow threefold in the next few years by 2030. This will not change – the faster we live, the greater the need for such things.
The main recipients are people from big cities, working in corporations?
Not only that, there is a surprise here. We did research several times and it turned out that this applies not only to employees of large cities and large companies. And the interesting thing is that we have more men than women.
Really? I'm shocked.
Yes, and it is 60 to 40 percent. Men are very happy to use this application. Perhaps it's a matter of her style itself – it is not only empathetic, but also secular, neutral, normal, cool, practical. Maybe this is the reason why this is the case with us.
There are, of course, large and medium-sized cities, but also people from small towns and even villages. When we conducted surveys to get to know the persona, we found that approximately 15 percent are inhabitants of villages or towns with a population of up to 20,000. inhabitants.
That's interesting, the revival even reached the countryside.
Yes, waking up and wanting to use meditation, some form of reset, getting in touch with yourself or simply the need for daily mental hygiene. People in rural areas also have stress – on a different topic, maybe for different reasons, but they do. It was a big surprise for us, because at the beginning we thought it was just a corporate recipient. Of course, this is largely true, but other audiences are not only statistically noticeable, but have quite strong representation.
Creator of the Intu application about earnings in the wellness industry
How much can you earn in such a business today?
Intu had different moments. The beginning was promising, but everything was reinvested. Then we had a decline, a competing app came in and was very aggressive – so much so that reviews of our app showed one-star ratings with the competitor's name mentioned. We always had an average of 4.7-4.8-4.9, suddenly it dropped to 4.3-4.2. Ultimately, our revenues dropped and we were running at a loss.
However, we managed to get out of it, and it was even good for us. We are still in the process, investors are coming in – serious people who are thinking about going global with the product. We have English-language content ready. I don't want to go into full detail, but so as not to leave the question unanswered: yes, you can make a living from it.
However, on the Polish market it is a challenge. You need to have an element of authentic passion, desire and a sense of mission. As crazy as it sounds, it has to be a charge from the heart. All meditations in the application are recorded during… actual meditation – there is no fakery, no reading from a piece of paper, we don't make empty promises, it's all substantive and true. You need to have this element of motivation and determination to survive the challenges on the Polish market with this type of product.
How do you see the future of this market?
This is a growing market – globally, globally and locally in Poland. There are people who are either already convinced and doing something in this field, or mostly those who realize that maybe it would be worth doing something, but have not started yet.
Have you done research on the age of users?
Most people are between 30 and 50 years old, but there are also a surprisingly large number of young people.
So Generation Z too? I have seen research that young people feel much older than their age and that Generation Z is very stressed.
They are stressed, and meditation is not something strange to them – it is normal for them. They watch series in which every second character either goes to yoga, therapy, or meditates. In “Star Wars” they meditate, in “The Witcher” they meditate – everywhere. They are educated at the entrance and are just wondering which tool to choose. They are very technical, navigating the application is an everyday occurrence for them.
Thank you for the interview and good luck with your global plans!
Thank you.
