According to Kuleba, who was present during a telephone conversation in 2020 with the Russian side, the conversation with Putin was as formal and protocol as possible. He emphasized that communication took place without any “familiarity”, and the address was exclusively official.
Separately, the ex-minister recalled that Putin could sometimes react emotionally during conversations, but quickly returned to a restrained and controlled style.
“One time he lost his temper. This is when he directly barked into the phone: “You killed Zakharchenko!” And then he controlled himself – and everything came back again,” Kuleba said.
The ex-minister noted that at first Moscow probably counted on a more flexible position of the newly elected President of Ukraine on resolving the situation in Donbass. It was about attempts to promote agreements that could give Russia significant influence on Ukrainian politics. However, according to him, these expectations were not met.
“I think that at that time Putin was disappointed in Zelensky. He was disappointed in his ability to act out… My version of events is this: Putin believed that with Zelensky it would be easy to implement the Russian scenario for the reintegration of Donetsk and Lugansk on terms that would, in essence, give Russia a veto on key issues of internal and external development of Ukraine. [Зеленский] refused,” Kuleba noted.
He also added that for some time in Russia the agreements could be perceived as individual “incidents” of the negotiation process, and not as an unchangeable “policy.” However, later, in his opinion, it became obvious that Ukraine did not accept the proposed conditions.
“At the time of the conversation he [Путин] I already realized that this is politics. What is he pushing into ORDLO (certain areas of the Donetsk and Lugansk regions of Ukraine, occupied by the Russian Federation. – “GORDON”), but it doesn’t get stuffed. And that Zelensky is not the person who will take away ORDLO on Russian terms,” Kuleba added.
Context
At least six telephone conversations between Zelensky and Putin are known. The first, in July 2019, discussed the situation in Donbass and the issue of exchange of detainees. The Kremlin said that Kyiv initiated the call.
During the second conversation, in August, Zelensky discussed with Putin the violation of the truce in Donbass, which resulted in the death of Ukrainian soldiers, as well as the construction of a bridge in Stanitsa Luganskaya and the release of prisoners, Espreso reported.
As the Office of the President (OP) reported, during a call on November 25, the head of the Ukrainian state pointed out the importance of Russia’s recent return of Ukrainian ships, noted the need for the return of all weapons, equipment and documentation, and also raised the issue of gas negotiations in the trilateral Ukraine-Russia-EU format.
In a telephone conversation on December 31, the parties agreed to “immediately” move to agreeing on lists for the release of Ukrainians, in particular Crimeans, and “expressed hope” for a “complete ceasefire” along the demarcation line in Donbass in the near future, the OP said.
On December 9, 2019, the first summit in three years of the leaders of the Normandy Four – Ukraine, France, Germany and Russia – to resolve the situation in Donbass took place in Paris. It lasted about eight hours. As part of the summit, state leaders held bilateral negotiations, in particular, a meeting between Zelensky and Putin took place. The parties agreed to agree on a complete ceasefire and exchange of detainees in an “all for all” format by the end of the year, discussed expanding the mandate of the OSCE observation mission and announced a new Normandy Four summit in four months.
On February 14, 2020, according to the OP, Zelensky and Putin again had a telephone conversation. The parties discussed the implementation of the agreements of the Normandy summit and preparations for a new meeting of leaders. Separately, they discussed the exchange of detainees and the intensification of the work of the trilateral contact group in Minsk.
