Former head of the CIA: The price that Putin pays for the war with Ukraine exceeds the imagination
Petraeus was a commander in the war in Iraq, commander -in -chief in Afghanistan, and ultimately by 2012 the CIA director. Petraeus has been visiting Ukraine many times since Russia's full invasion. Die Welt met him in the margins of “Kyiv Security Forum” held on May 8-9 this year. in the capital of Ukraine to conduct this interview.
Gen. David Petraeus: Everything that will help Ukraine convince Putin that he cannot achieve further territorial gains on the battlefield at acceptable costs. We saw that he was ready to suffer terrible losses. Estimates speak of 950,000 killed and wounded Russians, of which about 500,000 It couldn't return to the front. So the point is to give Ukraine further support.
Sanctions for Russia are also needed – in the form of additional packages, such as those proposed by Lindsey Graham in the US Senate. Thanks to the voices of over 70 senators, he would have enough facilities to [w razie konieczności] vote the president in this matter. However, I do not expect that this will happen, taking into account the strong support that Senator Graham enjoys on the part of President Trump. I am sure that we will be able to convince him of the need to take further action against Russia.
A few weeks ago The US government presented a project of a peace agreementwhich, among others, provided for the recognition of Crimea as Russia. Did Ukraine make the right decision by rejecting this proposal?
The government of Ukraine clearly hinted that the President of Ukraine could not agree to this, because the constitution is forbidden – just like he did in relation to joining NATO. This is just reality. The US Secretary of State said that a permanent and fair agreement is necessary. Ukrainians rightly emphasized that there must also be a security guarantee. This is a particularly difficult issue.
I know that the heads of the government of France and Great Britain are wondering how to give such a guarantee. As a former commander in two wars and the CIA director, I also tried to find a way to provide it. I came to the conclusion that the best guarantee would be to give Ukraine such a lot of additional support that the violation of the suspension of weapons by Russia would cause the catastrophic reaction of Ukraine. I am not sure if there is a construction – even with the participation of foreign armed forces on the spot – which would really stop Putin from breaking such an agreement.
From the left: German Chancellor Friedrich Merz, Prime Minister Donald Tusk (at the back), President of France Emmanuel Macron, Prime Minister of Great Britain Keir Starmer (at the back) and the first lady of Ukraine Olena Złeska during the ceremony of submitting a candle at the Maidan of Independence in Kiev, May 10, 2025.
What exactly do you understand by additional support for Ukraine? Is it about long -range weapons such as [pociski] Taurus?
Yes, it would certainly include long -range weapons. However, it is also about more air and missile defense systems – especially those that Ukraine is unable to produce by itself. The Ukrainian arms industry has revived significantly. It is currently the most innovative arms industry in the world. Drones produced here are not only “the most modern”, but also are at the absolute technological lead. For all this possible, money is needed. Thanks to more financial resources, Ukraine can produce from four to five million drones this year – compared to 1.5 million last year. Kyiv estimates that this year it will be 2.5 million drones.
In what condition are the Ukrainian armed forces after more than three years of war?
Former Prime Minister Arseniu Jacentiuk described Ukraine on these days as “wounded, but not broken, tired, but not exhausted.” And I think this is quite an accurate term. There is still the same determination and immunity. But you can also see some war fatigue among the population – and I can only imagine that it is equally strong on the front.
In spring, the United States made a lot of pressure on Kyiv and temporarily suspended help. What would be the consequences for Ukraine if the United States completely withdraws their support?
I think this is very unlikely. US support will continue and military assistance channels are very well filled. This year, Ukraine has, for example, large stocks of 155 mm artillery ammunition – it had to ration last year. Package worth $ 300 million [1 mld 127 mln zł] For training and maintenance of F-16 aircraft, there is also a close approval by the US Congress.
Russia also begins to exhaust its most important financial reserves, in particular the National Welfare Fund. Instead of social benefits, this money is increasingly allocated to defense expenses. They can run out next year.
What advice would you give to Europe under the new American administration? What do you expect from New German Chancellor Friedrich Merz?
I expect additional leadership strength from him – the one he has already shown to become the chancellor of the largest economy and the most important country in the EU. President Trump achieved something that no other US president managed: he prompted Europeans, and above all the new German Chancellor, to really seriously treat the issue of defense.
Of course, the threat has disappeared for a long time [po II wojnie światowej]. It is understandable that the peace dividend was talked about. The importance of defense remained [w Europie] reduced. Focused [w ramach NATO] On missions outside the alliance – in Afghanistan, against pirates off the coast of Somalia and so on.
And then suddenly the threat returned. I am not joking: Vladimir Putin is the greatest gift for NATO since the end of the Cold War. The irony of fate is that he wanted to restore the size of Russia, but in fact he restored the size of NATO. And the best way to completely bind the United States with NATO is to show your own European defense measures.
